Turbo, Oil Pump, RV, Clutch, Fuel Inj, Engine Guidelines

Turbocharger repairs, alternative options and mods

Re: Turbocharger Guidelines & Oil Pump/RV/Clutch/Engine Upgr

Postby yoko205 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:43 pm

ok thanks for the info, my turbo arrived in Uruguay !!! but not yet to my hand. this weekend armed with the new update
sorry for the questions, my configuration will not rediador oil, I find two different sizes in the forum readings, 7 or 8 mm between the ports of the gallery
.
the oil micro screen is used or not? in the new update , Sorry but I'm not clear on translations
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Re: Turbocharger Guidelines & Oil Pump/RV/Clutch/Engine Upgr

Postby Dirck » Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:58 pm

Look here Yoko >>----> viewtopic.php?f=29&t=13400 The M6NTL way (Thanks to Mark).

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Re: Turbocharger Guidelines & Oil Pump/RV/Clutch/Engine Upgr

Postby yoko205 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 3:54 pm

I understand 5mm is for configuration with oil cooler
but if I do not use radiator is 7 or 8mm the baypas?
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Re: Turbocharger Guidelines & Oil Pump/RV/Clutch/Engine Upgr

Postby Dirck » Fri Nov 13, 2015 5:07 pm

Hi Yoko. Hope this clears things up better.


'Removing oil cooler' thread is here Pete: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=14212&p=132660&hilit=oil+cooler#p132660

by Charlie @ Evergreen » 15 Dec 2014 08:36

"hey NK...
Tap the holes with your plug of choice 10mm or 1/4 pipe. Open the oil feed (between the two ports from top of pan) to
8mm now that you plugged the port. Make sure you pull the rear plug off pan and thoroughly wash the shavings out ! No issues at all and runs great. Also think some of the oil drain back was filling the sub pan and turbo after shutoff..Don't see any oil ever seeping out."

Another 'Oil Cooler Delete' conjecture thread. viewtopic.php?f=2&t=14206&p=132572&hilit=oil+cooler#p132572

Your wise to retain the re-install option. IMO, an oil temp gauge ought be constantly viewable while riding if the cooler is deleted.

by Charlie @ Evergreen » 27 Oct 2015 06:51

Plate with O Rings would work excellent also

If you drill the oil passage larger you will not have the re install option available as the oil passage would need to be restricted back down to 5mm.
No issues running without the cooler. Oil changes the oil looked clean. Of course I do not run over 1k on oil changes as oil flowing thru a turbocharger breaks down faster than a engine without a turbocharger.
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Re: Turbocharger Guidelines & Oil Pump/RV/Clutch/Engine Upgr

Postby Charlie @ Evergreen » Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:30 pm

Charlie @ Evergreen wrote:Short Version Posted in "How To"

The last couple years seeing so many HT10's and my own engines apart (2) this list gets a bit more detailed and longer. Apologize for this. These are the most common problem aged (30plus) issues I see when tearing into the turbochargers (some turbo's have very few miles on older engines) thinking where the problems originated. As you read you see its the two main area's well talked about here on 750turbo.com over the years. The Oiling System & the Clutch Dampers. The idea was to put this information in one place on 750turbo.com for all Info and PN's required with anyones tech input to help out.


Wanted to post this up if you removed your turbocharger for a rebuild & your still getting some or loads of oil leakage thru the seals. 99% of the time it will be something overlooked or modiified that will cause a issue...this is based on your turbocharger is in good operating condition....every one of the turbo's so far has had many issues....Got the idea to do this as the first turbocharger problem popped up last night and after Pm'ing back and forth worked out the issue.... the turbo and happy (now) owner is ready to put the boost on!


Some feed back from those who built a new engine or top end upgrade 810. Think its been about 1.5 years on the forum and up to about 45 turbo's now built. Have seen 3 that came back with issues inside from debris cutting the bearings/bores/shaft journals. With the upgraded oiling system & clutch basket there has not been one with a issue. 1 turbo for sure had no upgrades on the oiling/clutch the first go around and found debris in oil pan from the clutch basket. All sorted. 2nd one memory serves had a fresh top end & the 3rd which got my attention as I was there was a complete fresh engine. So here is where I would like some feed back from those built new engines or top ends installed. On this 3rd engine when up in TN few months ago Scotts 810 was totally built from bottom up. Fired up and run for about 150 miles..oil dumped and had the silvery film on top of oil. Changed out the oil and filter and run another 225 miles. At this point when doing a check over on the engine and systems discovered the turbocharger bearings were lil loose. Once fired up it was smoking constantly verifying there was a issue. Another oil change and the extra fresh turbo installed and instantly of course the issue solved..rode the miles that day and not a spot of smoke or smell..the previous rides especially the long 200 plus day I rode behind Scott to keep a eye on anything..which I saw a puff here and there..light hazing at one down mountain area. So there were signs of a issue. Note that only saw the silvery film on the first oil change during break in.
My thought is a fresh engine breaking in & setting the rings and all this silvery particulates we saw on first oil change when the turbo pulled apart looked like the bearings had been sanded down. Now since then with couple oil changes and the new turbo no issues. So I want to put this out there and your opinions welcomed. I do this on my own personal engines of any type I build.
First time you fire your engine up ....get it hot and let run for 10 to 15 minutes..put a fan on it if you have to..then dump the oil change out to get the initial contaminates out of the engine..then do another at 50 miles to be safe. Oil is cheap compared to fixing a charger again and the shipping especially from you guys overseas. Whats your thoughts on this? I would like to suggest you do the double change of oil for preventive oil contamination.

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Changes-


Oil Supply Line - Changing the oil feed line or banjo on the turbo - what can happen here is to much volume oil flowing into the turbo and the sump can not keep up. The oil fills the cavity of the bearing housing and then forces the oil thru the seals on both sides. Gonna test this out with the banjo on the turbo..modify one and see if it really can flow to much oil for this engine...be good knowledge for us to have on this part of the system. So far with the added pump, relief valve & cross drilled both banjo's the sump does a excellent job.

***Update: Tested the Oiling System to the turbocharger with the Pan Mods', Banjo Bolts Bores Drilled out & Cross Drilled larger than recommended (.093) with NO Oiling Issues at all. The Sump Pump has no problem keeping up with the added Oil Flow. Mentioned this could be a problem above as it is a common issue on many aplications..but no on our 750 turbo's. This should add to better service life of the turbocharger.

==============================================================================================================================================


Recommended Upgrades: Oil Pump/Pressure Relief Valve/ Oil Pan Modifications/Banjo Bolts Modification

PLEASE DO THIS AFTER YOUR UPGRADES

OIL CHANGE Procedure:

After all these modifications are done there is likely some residue from the clutch basket in the engine cases. There for would suggest once you get all your new installed parts on and fired up. Do a short oil/filter change to clean out whats left in the engine. Say at about 50 miles...Oil is cheap compared to going back inside your engine.

If your Oil Pan looks like this one, I suggest you remove your Main Oil Galley Plugs on both sides of engine and clean out the trapped area in the plugs, remove the Oil Cooler and Oil Lines and properly clean them from contaminants. Run engine for 10 minutes and dump the oil! Your engine will have these lil particles of dampers sticking all over the inside of your engine. Then do as above for standard quick oil changes. Know its a lot of oil to use for quick cleaning up..but cheaper than fixing the engine or turbocharger from debris running thru the bearings.

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The Oil Micro Screen doing its job! I know many suggest removing it as a restriction. Do not agree...even as full of damper material as this one is the turbo still was getting plenty of oil and saved the Turbine Shaft from getting destroyed Journals. Bearing Housing Bores take most of the damage with Micro Filter left in place. With the Upgrades to Oiling System done there is even better volume & Pressure to the engine/turbocharger.

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How To Section for Oil Pan Modifications.

Pics to come soon of the two ports drilled out for more flow. Banjo Bolts modifications

On my 750 I also have crossed drilled both banjo bolts with the larger hole in conjunction with the ZR7S High Pressure/Volume Oil Pump & Relief valve. With the addition of the upgrades and banjos enhanced for more flow there still is no oil leaking issues with the added oil pressure and volume. This is a good thing to keep more volume of oil to the charger for better oiling/cooling/lubrication of the charger itself. Also as a note on my testing. Removed the oil cooler completely and modified the pan accordingly. Larger transfer (8mm) oil port and NPT plugged the oil line ports.
For those that need the Oil Pan & Banjo Bolts Upgraded, can provide this service when your turbo is rebuilt.

Upgraded Oil Pump & Relief Valve PN's

ZR7S Oil Pump PN 16082-1158
ZR7S Relief Valve PN 16130-1058

Dave's (Youngblood) Complete Cross Reference Application where the Oil Pump & Relief Valve is used

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=15185&p=145197#p145197


ZR7S Gyrator Gears are taller more oil volume

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ZR7S Relief Valve PN 16130-1058

Higher Oil Pressure with more stable spring/piston assembly


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Items needed to upgrade your OIl Pan & Clutch Basket to reinstall Parts
Oil Pan Main Galley O Rings PN 92055-077 (3)
Oil Pan Oil Pump O Ring PN 92055-074 (1)
Sub Pan O Ring PN 92055-1211
Sub Pan O Ring PN 670B1510
Main Pan Large O Ring 671B2590
Clutch Cover Gasket PN 14046-035
Alternate Clutch Cover Gasket - http://www.ebay.com/itm/KAWASAKI-1980-1 ... c0&vxp=mtr

Oil Pan Gasket PN 11060-1586 (1) Alternate Ebay Seller makes a Reproduction Gasket $24.99..good quality, search ebay for " ZX750turbo oil pan gasket" Here is a current ID Number as of 3/15/2015 http://www.ebay.com/itm/KAWASAKI-ZX750- ... c4&vxp=mtr


Stock Oil Pump vs ZR7S Oil Pump & Relief Valve
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=13983&hilit=stock+oil+pump+vs+ZR7S

Oil Drain Line - Blockage in the line - I know..what ? How? Usually from being taken apart..there is a small part of a rag to keep crap outta the turbocharger if only removed for service on engine...or the rubber drain line is plugged to keep dirt out....

ADDED: If your drain line is soft from aging replace the drain line as the rubber line can be sucked closed from the sump pump.

ADDED: Have had some of the turbo's come in with the drain pipe attached. If you can send the drain pipe with your turbocharger I will make sure they are flat. Reason is take your drain pipe and put a straight edge on the mounting flange and check for flatness. They are usually bent and will leak even with a new gasket so the need to be straightened. For those of you who want to do this...one very easy way..lay the drain pipe flange down on a vice pad and one or two hits on the top with a hammer will get it flat with in a few thousands. Some came in with as much as a .020 gap bent from over torquing the two allen bolts.

Sump Pump - Check the Sump if it is working correctly... I saw a post Tack put up about doing this..I will go back and find it and stick it on here...

Tacks Post on Sump Pump Testing & Breather Filter - viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11117&p=94746&hilit=sump+test#p94746


Here is the Sump Pump. You can see the two outer oil ports that use half moon O Rings. The leak could be where those two O Rings install on engine. You can see the driver shaft on Rotor Gear to align in your engine. Its also possible the inner seal on shaft is leaking.

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Sump Pump Cover off...this is the one for my 810. The cover had some light marks I lapped off on lapping plate

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Gyrator Gears removed. The housing has a highlighted radius..but no groove. Gears show no wear. Installed a new O Ring to seal the Cover.
Hope this helps on the pump end if you find a problem with yours.

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Ventilation - This is very important!! If your crankcase base pressure is high because the breather line is gummed up or blocked off (for cleaning reasons :rofl: ) you will have such high base pressure even the Sump Pump can't overcome. You will have oil going thru both seals dumping into the exhaust & into the intake pipe to your airbox....check the drain to be sure there is no oil in the airbox...

If you find Clutch Damper debris in the oil pan suggest you remove your oil cooler and lines and properly flush them out reverse flow to clean any debris left in the oil cooler. This is came about way back in the 1990's and not having owned one of these bikes back then didn't know what the black looking crud was from.

Update: Changed the Breather Vent Tube with a flexible line run up behind the Side Cover with a small K&N Filter attached. Idea was to run it uphill and prevent oil oil buildup in the stock location from operation that would drop oil after running from venting wet vapor. With the K&N uphill and back its no longer dripping any oil from the Vent Line.

Oil Level - Do not overfill...the oil under the sump that didn't get sucked up and the small pan will run back into the turbo and leaks thru the seals. Also I think the oil cooler and lines drain down into the mini pan and it will fill the turbocharger bearing housing. I have been testing the oil level....I am a bit over half on my window and I only get a tick of smoke for a couple minutes then gone ...so this is a bit to full..previously I had about cup less oil and no smoke at all....

Update:
Clutch Basket
Pan & Pump Upgrades

I would suggest with the internal damage seeing in the turbocharger that when you take off the turbocharger you also rebuild your clutch basket with new dampers. This is one of the main issues tearing up turbos and those dampers are 30 years old now if you have not replaced them. I pulled all three of my baskets out to inspect and they were all cracked & shrunk in size, with particles of it in the screen & pan. The stock oiling system as many know is not adequate. Suggest at least the relief valve shimmed & better yet install the ZR7S Pump & Relief Valve. This will ensure you have good oil pressure/volume and no clutch debris in your oiling system.

For those who want to repair there clutch baskets.

Contact Steve for Viton Dampers to purchase separately.
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=12071&hilit=clutch+dampers&start=300

Contact Roger for Clutch Basket Rebuild. Dampers are not sold separately.
Complete Clutch Basket Repair/Riveted like Original with Delrin Dampers. As of 4/15 Rogers price is $200.00 for complete clutch.
Roger Twito's email turbo1rt@aol.com

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Update: Intake Manifold Rubbers
750 Turbos are 30 plus now. If you have not replaced your inlet throttle body inlet rubbers now is a good time. You can do a intake leak test ( I found 3) sealed them up with Silicone...which did not work on all three. Worth the investment to install all 4 new ones. Once this was done my engine starts smoother, Idles constant all the time & sure the A/Fs are all within a fraction of each other under boost.



Added: If your engine is noisy from Cam Chain Tensioner being sticky..Suggest you replace it with a Manual Cam Chain Tensioner.

Doing all the above whether or not you rebuild your turbocharger will give you a quieter better running engine..no worries on oiling, clutch damper issues, noisy cam chains & proper ventilation of the crankcase. I know the difference in my engine from last year when acquired is much quieter and no worries about any of those issues causing a serious engine issue.

Updated 7/2/15
Problem area: Fuel tanks rusting. Wanted to throw this in the mix since my tank looked great outside and was horrible inside. Did a acid wash and thought it was clean but no scope to look. Well a year later and a scattered number 4 piston due to lean on boost with a plugged petcock becomes very expensive to rebuild your engine due to a rusty tank. Suggested get the tank professionally cleaned and sealed or if your like most and want to tackle it did the job on the complete tank and assembly parts in half a day. Suggested recommended POR15 works excellent. Cleaner, etching acidic bonding agent & sealer that hardens like a ceramic coating.
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Engine issues...well this is where things get ugly..but sure you know what I am saying..time to go inside...

I know many of you know this..but some may need the guideline..hope it helps out those who run into a issue and find what your dealing with when you find your turbo is leaking oil.

Time for boost now...lets go!!
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Re: Turbo, Oil Pump, RV, Clutch, Fuel Inj, Engine Guidelines

Postby yoko205 » Sat Jul 02, 2016 10:57 pm

hello, long time that I am about to write to thank everyone who helped me to upgrade clutch, oil panels and of course the HT10-b hitachi my gpz 750
are many names but basically charly for their excellent work.

the turbo to become better than new and works perfect.

after some health problems and finally put my bike and the road and runs perfectly.

then publishes photos of the new modification zzr 1200 front end and its new naked style

thank you all again, it is good to have a place like this :thumbup
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Re: Turbo, Oil Pump, RV, Clutch, Fuel Inj, Engine Guidelines

Postby Charlie @ Evergreen » Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:29 pm

:beer good to hear things are going good !!
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Re: Turbo, Oil Pump, RV, Clutch, Fuel Inj, Engine Guidelines

Postby Charlie @ Evergreen » Sun Feb 10, 2019 2:32 pm

Bump it up! :thumbup
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Re: Turbo, Oil Pump, RV, Clutch, Fuel Inj, Engine Guidelines

Postby Charlie @ Evergreen » Tue Oct 22, 2019 10:54 pm

After some 7000 plus miles on my 810 some updates I think matter.
There posted on the main page upgrades.
With the addition of the ZR7S upgrade Oil Pump and Relief Valve I have been running OEM Banjo Bolts, Oil Pan with no issues. Suggest leave them OEM with the upgraded Oil Pump/RV increasing the oil pressure and volume the drilled out holes are not necessary. Also have much higher oil pressure which should help keep the upper end properly lubricated. If you have done the modified banjo's and pan you should not have any issues. This setup also works with slightly less oil pressure. My engine showed about 4 lbs in comparison between the 2 setups. Hope this post has been helpful to all the members keep our beloved 750s running forever.
Will say since haven't ridden much last few years...starting to ride again feeling good. The engine fires right off with no issues and is smooth as silk...say a lot about once we get them running right how good this design was from Big K!

Cheers all :beer
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